The Alliance For Natural Health
  • PrayingMantis2

    Given that the CDC has done a study on the MMR vaccine and manipulated the data to get the results they wanted, can we even trust the U. S. government to be honest with the results of a general study of vaccines?

    • Barbara Wreesmann

      money is the only thing that gets to talk in america these days unfortunately.

    • Countrygirl1411

      CDC is nothing but a shill and spokesman for big pharma, they do nothing to protect we the citizens from the lies and deceit, but how could they when they are hand in hand with big pharma with the lies and deceit.

  • joannegrace

    By the way, I believe – years back -that I saw a story about Japan outlawing vaccinations under a certain age. They are definitely more enlightened, and less profiteering, than our country!

    • frank

      What they discovered was a drastic drop in SIDS. Hmm. Now why would that be?

      • Gerie

        There are SO many reasons to NOT vaccinate babies, ESPECIALLY newborns.

      • Why could that be? Because the pharmaceutical P.R. machine LIES.

        • Gerie

          And the vaccine industry is liable to NO ONE…. THAT is such a travesty… and they keep on pumping out more and more vaccines… forcing them upon our precious children and now more and more upon adults. I’ve NEVER had the flu vaccine.. don’t want aluminum and mercury injected into me plus all the other insidious adjuvants and preservatives. SO much info is available that from highly-credentialed sources, e.g. folks at Mercury Project.. Docu-series “The Truth About Vaccines,” Truth is coming out… more and more..

    • AutismDadd

      Sweden has outlawed mandatory vaccination just recently. Now why would a country do that I wonder?

  • holisticpoet

    According to Dr. Russell Blaylock who happens to be a retired brain surgeon, no infant should receive any vaccinations before they are two years of age. He states that their immune systems are not mature enough to get any immunity from them and these vaccinations stimulate the brain before it is mature enough causing neurological problems. This is not even considering all the toxic ingredients found in them.

    • frank

      Apparently nursing babies’ immune systems don’t adequately sero-convert from vaccines. I wouldn’t advise what they are told to do in Africa, which is to stop nursing! I’d rather stop the vaccines until the child is weaned. That would ensure one of two POSITIVE outcomes: Child would be older when vaccinated or would nurse longer.

      • Gerie

        SO much good info about this in The Truth About Vaccine series. How I wish all lawmakers, parents, everyone would watch this series… much, much truth there.

        • Proponent

          Now, had you stated..

          Gerie: ‘How I wish all lawmakers, parents, everyone would watch this series… much, much, much truth there.’

          I might have given the.. ahem.. series a go. But, I won’t.. not without that third and emphatic ‘much’ in there. If that is not there? That tells me.. your heart and mind really isn’t in it, nor, behind it.

          Plus.. I am a busy guy..

          (*goes back to trimming his toenails*)

          • Ron Roy

            ”Plus.. I am a busy guy.” And I wouldn’t be paid to watch that series. FTFY.

      • People have to give up this religious belief in vaccinations. There are ways to build strong immune systems and promote health. Injecting toxic chemicals, combined with noxious biological waste products from animals (containing foreign RNA, DNA, and viruses, like SV40) is NOT the WAY.

    • ALL vaccines are ALL poison, ALL the time. They are damaging and crippling adults, too. My brother got ALS from a TDap at the age of 57. He died a slow, horrible death from the toxins’ effects on his motor neurons.

      • tomonthebay

        TDap and ALS?????? What irresponsible nonsense.

        • First of all, thank you for your kind condolences. Yes, my brother was fit, lean and vibrant when he went in for a tetanus shot. (I understand that those are now given in TDap.) Within days of the shot, he felt weakness come over him, and as it became worse he went back to the doctor and was subsequently diagnosed with ALS. I had already done research and was aware of a 1967 BMJ article reporting vaccines of all kinds, plus tetanus shots and gamma globulin shots causing various auto-immune diseases, although the main focus was on multiple sclerosis. A friend of mine also had a severe reaction to a gamma globulin shot and was then diagnosed with MS, back in 1975.

          Tetanus Vaccination by Dr Mendelsohn MD (The People’s Doctor Newsletter 1976-1988):

          An article in the Archives of Neurology (1972) described brachial plexus neuropathy (which can lead to paralysis of the arm) prom tetanus toxoi Four patients who received only tetanus toxoid noticed the onset of limb weak ness from six to 21 days after the inoculation. A 1966 article published in the Journal of the American Medical Association reports the first case of “Peripheral Neuropathy .following Tetanus Toxoid Administration.” A 23—year— old white medical student received an injection of tetanus toxoid into his rightupper arm after an abrasion of the right knee while playing tennis. Several hours later, he developed a wrist drop of his right hand. He later suffered from complete motor and sensory paralysis over the distribution of the right radial nerve (one of the major nerves innervating the arm and hand).

          Reference is made to an article in the Journal of Neurology, 1977, entitled “Unusual Neurological Complication following Tetanus Toxoid Administration.” The author reports a 36—year—old female who received tetantus toxoid in her left upper arm following a wound to her finger. Five days later, she noticed a weakness first of the right, and then of the left and later of both legs. She complained of dizziness, instability, lethargy, chest discomfort, difficulty in swallowing, and inarticulate speech. S staggered when she walked, and she could take only a few steps. Her EEG showed some abnormalities. After a month, she was discharged without neurologic disturbance, but she continued to feel weak and anxious. Examinations during the next 11 months showed continued emotional instability and some paresthesias (numbness and tingling) in the extremities. The medical diagnosis was “a rapidly progressing neuropathy with involvement of cranial nerves, myelopathy, and encephalopathy.”

          Aluminum hydroxide injections lead to motor deficits and motor neuron degeneration

          Christopher A. Shaw; Michael S. Petrik.

          Journal of Inorganic Biochemistry (2009) in press

          Gulf War Syndrome is a multi-system disorder afflicting many veterans of Western armies in the 1990–1991 Gulf War. A number of those afflicted may show neurological deficits including various cognitive dysfunctions and motor neuron disease, the latter expression virtually indistinguishable from classical amyotrophic lateral sclerosis (ALS) except for the age of onset. This ALS ‘‘cluster” represents the second such ALS cluster described in the literature to date. Possible causes of GWS include several of the adjuvants in the anthrax vaccine and others. The most likely culprit appears to be aluminum hydroxide.

          • tomonthebay

            And not one of those articles are proof of any link to TDap and ALS. What happened to your brother was a tragedy. That doesn’t make it right for you to spread nonsense.

          • They most certainly are. When vaccines and tetanus shots (and gamma globulin shots) have been found to cause autoimmune diseases, including autoimmune diseases which produce paralysis, that’s a match, and the TDap also contains aluminum adjuvants.

            “There are three basic aluminum salts used in vaccines: aluminum hydroxide, aluminum phosphate and potassium-aluminum sulfate, or alum. The three forms are not interchangeable as they each have their own chemical properties.

            “Doctors have identified that the aluminum-hydroxide in the vaccines stays at the site of the injection for years. The whole time it is there, it is stimulating an immune response. Which is exactly why the vaccine makers include it in the vaccine, so that the immune system will react more strongly to the virus or toxoid. But switching the immune system on without turning it off is not good for the body.

            “This appears to be what causes the chronic fatigue seen in MMF.2

            “A new disease has been identified, first in France, called macrophagic myofasciitis (MMF). The condition manifests with spread out muscle pain and chronic fatigue. One third of the patients develop an autoimmune disease, such as multiple sclerosis (MS) or amyotrophic lateral sclerosis (ALS or Lou Gehrig’s disease). Even if they don’t have an obvious autoimmune disease, most of them are part of a subgroup called HLADRB1*01 that puts them at risk of developing polymyalgia rheumatica and rheumatoid arthritis.1

            1 Gherardi RK, “Lesson from macrophagic myofasciitis: towards definition of a vaccine adjuvant-related syndrome,” Rev Neurol (Paris). 2003 Feb; 159 (2): 162-4.

            “Aluminum hydroxide is an adjuvant used in the following vaccines: DTaP, BioThrax, DPT, Engerix-B, Gardasil, Havrix, LYMErix, Prevnar, Rabies Vaccine Adsorbed, Recombivax, and Tripedia.

            “Science has proven that the following conditions may all be caused by the aluminum-hydroxide in vaccines: Chronic fatigue, Multiple sclerosis , Lou Gehrig’s disease, Demyelinating central nervous system disorders, Plymyalgia rheumatica and rheumatoid arthritis, Motor delay, Hypotonia or diminished muscle tone, Failure to thrive, Apoptic neurons, which are self-destructing neurons in the lumbar spinal cord, Neuron loss in the lumbar spinal cord.”
            From the December 2007 Idaho Observer
            “Aluminum-hydroxide in vaccines causes serious health problems” Tenna Merchant.

          • tomonthebay

            Classic confusion of correlation and causation.

          • “Classic confusion of correlation and causation” is classic use of those words without anything to back it up.

          • tomonthebay

            No, it is an accurate description of your lack of understanding of how to interpret scientific data.

          • No, you can’t just toss out a few words as if you are some authority, without demonstrating your “superior” understanding, and addressing, point by point, where the lack of causation is proved.

          • tomonthebay

            Yes I can as I have actually been published in peer reviewed scientific journals, hold multiple patents and have a Ph.D. in Pharmaceutics. Correlation does not prove causation. A couple of articles showed a possible correlation. They most certainly did not prove causation.

          • Aaron Weizmann

            So, let then do the research, of course in an honest non-corrupted way.

          • AutismDadd

            But there’s less $$$ then.

          • AutismDadd

            Buh Wah Ha Ha..of course another expert…

          • AutismDadd

            Typical shill, you’re ALL doctors and published…yea right

          • AutismDadd

            tomonthetake

          • 655321

            Quick question, can you prevent the shill accounts from clogging up your feed with discussion invites?

          • AutismDadd

            Don’t know. Hasn’t happened to me. Sounds odd

          • 655321

            Occasionally get bombed with invites to random forums by blatant spam/shill accounts. Just some attempt at harassment I suspect.

          • AutismDadd

            Probably Jonathon Buzzcut Ginger Butthurt Graham

          • 655321

            Lol, the picture he chose shows at least some sense of humor, though maybe a little twisted.

          • AutismDadd

            I blocked him long ago. Too big a puke.

          • 655321

            Does he still lurk these boards? I think I blocked him too?

          • AutismDadd

            Under ” just bored now”

          • kfunk937

            Or maybe you could learn how disqus works, Herbie.

            See that gear icon? Click on it, then select settings, then notifications. Untick the “someone invites you to a discussion” tickbox.

            Alternatively, I hear that getting banned by a channel Moderator is also effective, one channel at a time. 😉

            If you can’t fgure out something as simple as the day-to-day user mechanics of the commenting platform you frequent (with plain language directions, help and discussion sections, fer cryin’ out loud), what makes you so sure you can tackle and understand more complex problems, like vaccines, science, etc.?

          • Ben

            …day-to-day user mechanics of the commenting platform you frequent—with plain language directions, help and discussion sections, fer cryin’ out loud—what makes you….

            Whoa!*

            *A Joey Lawrence “whoa,” not a Keanu Reeves “whoa.”

          • Ben

            [*ETA: as when Travis emailed Thomas Mohr (at his invitation, after “Ben” challenged TM’s identity), “warning” him that someone was impersonating him on the interwebz… using his own email address….

            I thought it was him, but I just had to check.

            What you probably didn’t know is that I e-mailed him before I viewed his post. It was only six minutes after he had posted it (as confirmed by timestamps) but I was completely unaware of it’s existence.

            I was pretty sure it was him. I never doubted him all along until a certain commentator notified me that “he was lying.”

            Filled with fear, uncertainty, and doubt…I did some spelunking and found Thomas Mohr’s e-mail address—from his own lair (The Vienna Cancer Something or Other Institute), and next to a photo . So after I had enlarged and printed-off this photograph for a new dartboard veneer, I e-mailed the real Thomas Mohr to notify him that he was actually impersonating himself—and doing an terrible job. I can do better…

            Th☹ma⚡: “Well. It doesn’t matter that Jon made an error in his rebuttal. What matters is that [makes similar error, confabulates things]!!! I’ll tell you the VEGF is cancer!! and methylglyoxal is just a pony.

          • 655321

            How many profiles do you use Dave?

          • kfunk937

            Dave’s not here. Literally. I’m not Dave, whoever that is. Did you find the helpful hints on disqus use to be at all helpful, Herbie? Probably not, given your paranoia as evidenced in the comment to which I’ve replied.

          • 655321

            Funny stuff. wish I had financial gain like yourself to post here all day.

          • And yet you can never provide evidence.

            Odd considering how blatant it is.

          • Aaron Weizmann

            Tell the truth Tom. Are you on someone’s payroll to support vaccines? C’mon, fess up.

          • tomonthebay

            Where do I sign up for this payroll? I could use the supplement to my retirement. The chicken food safety patents are eventually going to expire and they don’t produce enough to support me anyway. That money goes in to my hunting trip fund.

          • AutismDadd

            Oh, an animal killer. Off to Africa to kill lions?

          • tomonthebay

            One last note. Really. Where do I sign up for this payroll you keep spouting about?

          • AutismDadd

            Ask you MD brothers

          • tomonthebay

            OK, I can’t resist. Once more you show that you just post things with no actual knowledge. Bye-bye.

          • Aaron Weizmann

            It’s about the children, Tom. Where is your concern? Isn’t it best to be sure that vaccines’s are not hurting children? Isn’t that what we should be talking about, not credentials, not understanding science, but INSURING that we have not been injuring and killing children? Keep your eyes on the ball.

          • tomonthebay

            I agree it is about the children, which is exactly why I support vaccination. I am quite grateful that I was vaccinated for polio as a child. I remember my father helping distribute the vaccine at my school. I am glad that I never had to fear polio.

          • AutismDadd

            Are you just a shill?

          • Moss Quito

            Stooge/shill again…

          • AutismDadd

            OK then now we know.

          • Moss Quito

            Found that evidence for your claims yet? Ask Sablemouse, she claims to have done years of research (I hope you can read crayon)

          • AutismDadd

            What claims?

          • Moss Quito

            She claimed that she spent years thoroughly investigating vaccine injury-autism links blah blah..way back in the 90’s.
            I have asked you countless times for evidence..any evidence that proves your anti vaxx claims and is supported by peer review. I will accept any study that is validated by any accredited university.
            I have given you a tonne of evidence that disproves your crackpot belifs but will happily give more.

          • AutismDadd

            You provide nothing but chuckles Chuckie

          • AutismDadd

            Who is SHE?

          • Moss Quito

            Your stupidity knows no bounds. Of course, that was always obvious but sometimes you astonish me with how disturbingly stupid you are. You shouldn’t breed.
            Just read the previous entry and you will see we were discussing Sabelmouse.

          • AutismDadd

            I read your posts to help with insomnia. You should bottle your crapola, call it Dimwit.

          • Moss Quito

            Still waiting for your evidence. Still waiting for proof of pharma shill’s or proof of Autism, cancer, auto immune being caused by Vaccines.
            Don’t you call anyone stupid or dim, you and your little pals group already own stupid.
            We reckon your’e probably a religious zealot and most likely a Flat earther…see, I don’t just think your’e as dumb as Trump.

          • AutismDadd

            Very nice job babbling like a bloody idiot. Please continue

          • Moss Quito

            Yes, ok, whatever. Lets see this evidence. I have asked you over and over and yet still you offer nothing. EVIDENCE..show me your scientific and peer reviewd studies that prove vaccines cause serious long lasting illnesses ie Auto immune, Autism, Cancer, etc, etc.

          • AutismDadd

            Its easily found doing a search.

          • tomonthebay

            You can’t actually respond to Moss in a meaningful way because you can’t produce real evidence to back your claims and the reason for that is that your “evidence” does not exist.

          • AutismDadd

            For someone claiming to be a doctor, your language is both pedestrian and juvenile. That scares me and should frighten your employer and patients.

          • tomonthebay

            Not an MD doctor but a professor doctor. Taught pharmacy for 9 years. Published in chronobiology, chronotoxicity, and drug stability. Don’t really care what you think. Arguing with you was entertaining at first but it is too much like arguing with any fundamentalist so it and you have become quite boring and I won’t waste any more time on you. as to the internet being the great equalizer, ahhhh, not so much. It isn’t much use to people like you that don’t understand what you are reading and/or don’t know how to sift throught what is legitimate and what is fraud. I also am on e food safety patents. Just deposited a royalty check today. The money goes in to my hunting trip fund. I have been to Africa and hope to go again. No African lion hunting as I don’t have that kind of money but there is a mountain lion on the window bench over my front door that I shot while mule deer hunting in Idaho. Looking at another Idaho hunt. A deer tag can be used on a deer, bear or lion which is rather unique. I am looking for a bear as I want a rug mount. I will look at my finances and health in 4 years and if both have held up I will be going back to Africa for a Cape buffalo hunt with the possibility of a leopard and/or sable. If the stock portfolio keeps performing then my choosing to retire early will not be an impediment to taking that trip. Have a nice life.

          • AutismDadd

            So you’ll kill anything to make yourself feel masculine. What a punk.

          • Ben

            I admit to being confused about the Offit Passage since it is intentionally-misleading and deceptive, but after trusting my instinct and plowing-forward I am 100% certain that he’s wrong. I read it dozens of times and did all the math. The real answer is 10 vaccines because he equates incipient B-cells with progeny B-cells spaced one-week apart in his final equation.

            These are not equivalent, something he states himself in the article:

            3) a single B-cell clone takes about 1 week to reach the 10³ progeny B-cells required to secrete 10 ng/mL ―Offit

            Look what happens when you make these equivalent:

            1 B-cell = 10³ B-cell

            1 B-cell = 10³ B-cell

            1 = 10³

            This is obviously false. When one transforms all of his statements into equations while differentiating between, progeny, incipient, and steady-state blood B-cells they will find out Offit’s error pretty quickly.

            What Offit really calculated was the amount of vaccines that would deliver one vaccine epitope to one B-cell at the time of vaccination. But since each one of these cells will then produce 10³ daughter cells, they will go-on to exceed the steady-state concentration of B-cells on week later by a factor of 10³. But since this cannot occur, 10³ of the vaccine-activated B-cells must die to find room for the newly-inoculated B-cells that will then go on to produce enough antibodies “required for immunity.”

            The real answer is 10,000 divided by 1,000. The real answer is ten vaccines.

          • Bored Now

            I admit to being confused

            Stop your post right there and that’s the most correct thing you’ve said in a while.

            they will go-on to exceed the steady-state concentration of B-cells on week later by a factor of 10³. But since this cannot occur,

            Sure can, cancer patients show enormous antibody production as a result from huge b-cell population increases.

            With vaccination only a small percentage of the B-cells produced are useful. The rest die. The 10ng/ml is an established threshold to achieve the amount of useful B-cells.

            So either you are almost entirely ignorant of immunology…..or you discovered your math error and now are trying to cover it up. I give even odds. What does everyone else think?

          • Mike Stevens

            I admit to being highly amused by his math contortions.
            To cover his error, he is now trying to say 1=1000.

            ….Or suggesting Offit is wrong because he points out that clonal expansion of a single B-cell into 1000 B-cells takes place over a period of one week.

            Strewth…
            I suppose Travis will now claim that 1 = 1000 because one bacterium divides into 1000 after 4 days….

            1 Bacterium = 10³ Bacteria
            1 Bacterium = 10³ Bacteria
            1 = 10³
            Hooray for Travis Math®!!!11!!!

          • Ben

            John. I’m only talking about “truth” within the Offit Passage. Obviously, Paul Offits logic and calculations cannot be used to create a very accurate estimate. There are many more factors.

            I’m just thinking within the Offit Passage right now and showing how Offit failed within his own model. Turn all of his prepositions into mathematical equations and with different symbols for the two B-cells. The cannot be made equivalent. Perhaps an arrow should be used, since this is a one-way event and cannot be reversed:

            Offit Claim #3

            ³¶ (ᵦC₀/mL) ⇒ (10³·ᵦCₑ/mL) [equivalent only at: t = 7 days]

          • Bored Now

            I’m only talking about “truth” within the Offit Passage.

            …and I’m only talking about what you said which was:

            will go-on to exceed the steady-state concentration of B-cells on week later by a factor of 10³. But since this cannot occur, 10³ of the vaccine-activated B-cells must die to find room for the newly-inoculated B-cells

            Which is incorrect in that it is possible to go beyond 10E7 b-cells without any dying and still return to the average count after the unnecessary b-cells have died. I’m sure everyone in the whole list of authors knows that.

          • Ben

            Of course Jonathan, but this is not what Paul Offit was driving at. This is not important.

            What is important is that Offit used the (10⁷·ᵦC/mL) for a reason. This is the upper-limit of B-cell concentration.

            And it can accommodate only 10⁴ monoclonal lines. At 10³ epitopes per vaccine, this makes ten vaccines.

            Offit Logic®—when done correctly—yields ten vaccines.

          • Bored Now

            Of course Jonathan, but this is not what Paul Offit

            …and my point is that the only person claiming this is you. The idea that you can’t go beyond a concentration of circulating 10E7 B-cells/mL and once differentiation occurs and the B-cell starts to create a progeny. Some of the undifferentiated cells would have to die to “find room” for the differentiated cells. Is simply not something the article said or implied and since this is a basic fact of immunology everyone on the paper would have known it.

            So you have no argument to say “Offit was getting at X” when it’s clear that X is antithetical to anyone with basic knowledge of immunology.

            Further justification for nobody bothering with your math when your basic immunology is so wrong.

          • AutismDadd

            I think Offit really just tried to bullshit. He said antigen and vaccines and other dumb things. Likely you know someone who is highly intelligent in one area, but they couldn’t drive a nail through a board.

          • Thomas Mohr

            The point is that you too do not understand Offits statement. Your problem is that you can’t drive a nail through a board. However, the first part, that is being highly intelligent in one area does not apply to you. You are just a sociopath wanting to expose children to a 1 in 1000 chance of dying.

          • AutismDadd

            Nice job showing how messed up you are.

          • AutismDadd

            Beer guzzling beer again?

          • Thomas Mohr

            AutismDadd, I do medical science, you neglect your family and children. So better leave here.

          • JGC

            Uhhh…you do realize that Offit did not state that 1 B-cell =10,000 B-cells? He stated that it takes about a week for one B cell to multiply sufficiently to produce a clonal population of 10000 B cells.

            your first line should read not

            1-B cell =10,000 B-cells

            but instead

            (1 x 10,000) B-cells = 10,000 B-cells.

          • Ben

            Duh. I’m merely showing that you cannot equate progeny cells with their incipient vaccine-stimulated B-cells on week earlier. If you do this—like Paul Offit had—you are off by a factor of 10³.

            Now come back after you personally check Offit calculations and logic yourself. Pay attention to units—always. I don’t want to deal with your derps.

          • Thomas Mohr

            You are wrong. Daughter cells are irrelevant for the model since they emerge after the response. The calculation is: 10E7 epitopes response capacity va. 10E3 epitopes per vaccine makes 10E4 vaccines.

            I really recommend you to shut up. You are only embarrassing yourself.

          • Ben

            You are wrong. Daughter cells are irrelevant for the model since they emerge after the response.

            Thomas. Off it was purportedly calculating the amount of vaccines a child could “respond to”. (Derp Thomas.) And now you’re saying the response does not matter?

            If every B-cell were to actually “effectively respond” to each one of these epitopes then the blood B-cell concentration would be (10¹⁰·ᵦC/mL).

            If you weren’t to set an upper limit for B-cell concentration, they you’d be able to respond to an infinite amount of vaccines. This is why Offit uses the concentration of B-cells, as an upper limit.

            Incipient clone cells and progeny cells one-week later are not the same thing and cannot be cancelled in the calculations. You will be off by a factor of 10³ if you do this.

          • Thomas Mohr

            Ok, Ben, once again. 10E7 different epitopes represented by initial B-cells divided by 10E3 epitopes represented by vaccines gives a response capacity of 10E4. Once again, Ben 10E7 is a starting number not an upper limit. The only thing that counts here is the initial B-cell count.

            BTW, Ben. I showed your “calculations” today to my class of students. They did not believe that anybody could be that stupid.

            Finally: if every B-cell would respond to the antigens with producing 1000 daughter cells, the total cell number would be 10E7 plus 1000*1000 = 1.1x10E7 and NOT 10E10. The epitope capacity would still be 10E7.

            You are a learning resistant idiot.

          • Ben

            ――Once again, Ben 10E7 is a starting number not an upper limit.
            So what is the upper limit? Infinity?
            ―― The only thing that counts here is the initial B-cell count.
            Then the maximum amount of vaccines “responded to” would be the total circulating B-cell level. For this, we need both concentration and absolute blood volume. Offit did not provide the volume, and this is not what he was driving at.
            ――BTW, Ben. I showed your “calculations” today to my class of students.
            No you didn’t. Sop lying.
            ――Finally: if every B-cell recognizing vaccine epitopes would respond to the antigens ――with producing 1000 daughter cells, the total cell number would be 10E7 plus ――1000*1000 = 1.1x10E7 and NOT 10E10.
            Okay. Now you’re just being stupid.

            Thomas: 10⁷ + 10³ = 1.1(10⁷)

            Wrong. The answer is 10¹⁰. We need multiplication because even you said ” if every B-cell […] produc[e] 1000 daughter cells…” Your addition is adding only daughter cells from one monoclone.

            In other words: you’re being painfully-stupid. Get away from me with that crap.

          • Thomas Mohr

            What you fail to realize is that 10E7 is not an upper limit and that 1mL is not a closed system.

          • Ben

            What you fail to realize is that 10E7 is not an upper limit…

            Tell that to Offit. He’s the one who originally used it as the upper-limit. Read that paragraph more carefully. (Using pillcrows now to save space. These mark the beginning of a paragraph.)¶ Here’s something you might be interested in: Glyoxylase I inhibitors! ¶Drug developers have spent a considerable amount of time creating inhibitors for this enzyme. It’s natural substrate is the methylglyoxal–glutathione adduct. This is formed spontaneously in the cytosol.

            S-p-Bromobenzylglutathione has a Kᵢ value of 2.2 μM (yeast enzyme) (Douglas et al., 1982) and 0.16 μM (human enzyme) (Allen et al., 1993a) and is the most effective S-aralkylglutathione inhibitor known.*

            Here is a similar molecule: sigmaaldrich(dot)com/catalog/product/sigma/sml1306?lang=en&region=US
            ――――See below for proof of efficacy!†――――
            You people should create an analogue of this, like substitute the bromyl-group for a methoxy-group or something like that. ¶This inhibits Glyoxylase I and raises cystosolic methylglyoxal concentrations. This is technically über-cancerostatic. ¶I think Szent-Györgi was wrong about methylglyoxal electronically-desaturating proteins. It actually selectively-adducts with arginine residues. This forms a substituted imidazole ring structure, as the methylglyoxal forms a bridge between arginine’s two terminal amines. This is fluorescent. ¶The function of this is open to speculation. Many say that it marks proteins for degradation, but I think that it could have implications in biophotonics. Photons actually transfer in vivo between fluorescent tryptophan indoles, histidine imidazoles, tyrosine phenols, and phenylalanine phenyls. This ultra-weak fluorescence has been measured. This is not woo. There are entire textbooks dedicated to biophotonics.
            ――――――――――――――――――――――――――――――――――
            *Thornalley, Paul J. “The glyoxalase system in health and disease.” Molecular aspects of medicine 14.4 (1993): 287-371.
            †Thornalley, Paul J., et al. “Antitumour activity of Sp-bromobenzylglutathione cyclopentyl diester in vitro and in vivo: inhibition of glyoxalase I and induction of apoptosis.” Biochemical pharmacology 51.10 (1996): 1365-1372.

          • Thomas Mohr

            Ben, please not the methylglyoxal story again. No human data, no claim to efficacy in humans, is that so difficult to grasp ? Come back with human data, ok ? But please not studies where patients quote: “greatly improved”, ok ?

          • Ben

            F-off Thomas. I was not cheerleading that study and you know it! Your implying that I brought that study to you as purported proof, but I hadn’t. I was the first to remark on the subjectivity of that study even before you had even seen it.

            No I highly doubt that you’re a drug-developer. Actually, I am almost certain that you’re not. Just another anonymous propagandist with no actual knowledge at all—at all.

            You don’t need human data to develop drugs. You should realize that they actually need to be sythesized before they are tested on anything—an·y·thing.

            And if there was human data on it, that proves that it had already been developed by someone else first. So what is the fun in that Th☹mas?

            Read these articles on the glyoxylase system below. Mmmkay Th☹mas. You sound pig-headed denying the obvious fact that this is a central control system in cellular growth and proliferation; right next to the polyamine system.

            Thornalley, Paul J. “The glyoxalase system in health and disease.” Molecular aspects of medicine 14.4 (1993): 287-371.

            Thornalley, Paul J. “Pharmacology of methylglyoxal: formation, modification of proteins and nucleic acids, and enzymatic detoxification-a role in pathogenesis and antiproliferative chemotherapy.” General Pharmacology: The Vascular System 27.4 (1996): 565-573.

          • Thomas Mohr

            “You don’t need human data to develop drugs. You should realize that the actually need to be sythesized before they are tested on anything—an·y·thing.”

            So what ? To be able to claim effectiveness in humans and to have a drug approved for use in humans you need clinical trials in humans. Everything else would be as useful as Pavarotti singing in a bath tub.

            I don’t care what you believe I am. You, for sure are *no* scientist, at
            least not in medicine or biology. I o.t.o.H have a decent publication
            list. Amongst others, in development of drugs.

          • AutismDadd

            Yea that sounds like Big Pharma plopaganda right Tommy Boy?

          • AutismDadd

            Ben has cuffed you left and right…buh wah ha ha

          • Mike Stevens

            Travis is resistant to learning, sure. But not an idiot…
            Just a mentally ill sociopath with npd.

          • Ron Roy

            I see you take pleasure in killing animals as much as you did humans by your false teachings. Prime example of a psychopath.

          • tomonthebay

            Another zealot from the church of vaccines are horrible. While you may or may not even have gotten your GED I have spent my life and career helping people get better and educating new pharmacists. When you or your loved ones buy chicken, it is safer thanks to the group I was involved with that created a product used by the industry to protect you from bacterial contamination. I also hunt and fish and actually spend money on conservation. I hope that your preaching hasn’t harmed too many people.

          • AutismDadd

            Those who CAN’T do…teach

          • tomonthebay

            And you apparently can’t read as I practiced for far more years than I taught. Of course your posts demonstrate your lack of comprehension.

          • AutismDadd

            All that ? I’m good..

          • 655321

            Says the guy that doesn’t understand the difference between evidence and agency statements/opinions.

          • tomonthebay

            Science was that class in high school that these people didn’t like and couldn’t they understand why they had to take such a boring class. Now the internet has made them “experts”. I have no doubt that some of them have family members that suffer from health problems and they are desperate for some kind of answer but unfortunately emotion is a poor substitute for judgement and understanding.

          • AutismDadd

            The internet is the Great Equalizer. No longer can your ilk lie about vaccines and now you are crying in your soup.

          • Moss Quito

            Well said. You are right in your assumption that they probably have family members who are ill, and they need to place blame. We all know that Autism doesn’t begin to show until the infant is around 2yrs..so of course, to them it must be the vaccines.
            This idiot AutismDadd, loves to claim he is an expert and his pal Sabelmouse did resurches back in d’90’s. They are ridiculous…but fun.

          • AutismDadd

            Sable and I think you and tom are a joke. Brainwashed, indoctrinated fools.

          • Moss Quito

            The fact you can’t even get your friends name right, is telling.
            Tom & I have offered and provided you with a veritable mountain of scientific and medical data. You have provided nothing but insults and lies.

          • AutismDadd

            What a clown

          • Moss Quito

            I wouldn’t call Sabel a clown. She is more like an incompetent, incapable moron.

          • AutismDadd

            How juvenile, but consistent.

          • Moss Quito

            You are the one that called her a clown. Don’t go blaming me for your comment.

          • AutismDadd

            Why would I give you credit for my outstanding comments?

          • Moss Quito

            Hardly outstanding. You called her a clown, which is a description of her..I’m sure you could do better and to earn an outstanding.

          • AutismDadd

            Why wait when you can just do some research?

          • Moss Quito

            I have and I have shown you mine. The conclusion is anti vaxxers do not understand basic science. You make these massive claims and yet this magical evidence you claim to have never appears.
            I want the evidence you and your crew claim to have. I want to see your evidence, your proof….I know your claims don’t stack and are just lies…prove me wrong.

          • AutismDadd

            At least I don’t have to prove you stupid, you’ve done a bang up job of that. Does clueless run in your family? Never heard about 3 congressional hearings grilling CDC minions about the studies done and NOT done? Come back when you are dialed into the issue.

          • Moss Quito

            You have no right to call anyone stupid. You are a petty, vindictive little man who believes he is ‘woke’.
            Newsflash. Those hearings found no evidence and twisted the info given to suit their own bias. What they achieved was removing Thermisol. Wow, removing a harmless stabilising/preservative agent, bravo.

            Those hearings ruled that autism was indeed a genetic condition that was prevalent pre vaccine and that the autism % rate in children has remained steady since it was first diagnosed.

            Let’s be clear politicians know nothing about science. Just because these politicos say ‘I know of a kid that got vaccinated and 2 years later he caught the autism’ That statement has no scientific evidence.
            There are Senators who believe that God makes hurricanes to punish Gay ppl. There are those who think that Climate change is a hoax or that God told them to run for President (10 at last election cycle).
            Any hearing where you place Senators with no scientific background against real life scientists is bound to throw up a lot of confusion and misinformation. These hearings were a perfect example of idiots like you cherry picking data and getting facts entirely wrong.

            We have proven that you are an idiot on too many occasions. You are an anti vaxxer—-nuff said.

          • AutismDadd

            More proof you are stupid. Please continue…

          • tomonthebay

            Actually, Moss is making you look like the not-so-bright one.

          • AutismDadd

            Take a hike Tommy Boy.

          • tomonthebay

            Truth can be an uncomfortable thing daddy-o.

          • AutismDadd

            Must be why you’re here spreading the usual pharma tripe

          • Moss Quito

            haha, there you go calling another person a ‘pharma shill’.

          • AutismDadd

            So you can be taught…

          • Moss Quito

            I have been taking you to school for months..your stupidity is still baffling.

          • AutismDadd

            Yet you don’t go away..If this is a bromance thing, I’m not interested

          • Moss Quito

            I’m waiting to see if you learn anything..but not matter how much evidence I give, you just stick with the lies. Case in point Wakefield..the facts are not up for discussion. He is a liar, fraud, and his trial under the BMA, states clearly he was guilty of all charges and should have faced criminal charges.
            Yet you stick to this ludicrous tale of him winning and being robbed by Big pharma…the man was trying to sell his vaccine with Thermisol, Alum salts etc to Big pharma..thus, you are an idiot.

          • AutismDadd

            Are you autistic?

          • Moss Quito

            What difference would that make? Being autistic preclude you from holding discourse. It does not make you incapable of being normal.

            You have proven with that statement that you are indeed a simpering fool.

          • AutismDadd

            You think being autistic makes no difference?

          • Moss Quito

            The Autistic spectrum is vast. You cannot just label Autistic people as all being the same or being ‘retarded.’ some of the greatest minds working in sciences, mathematics, physics, chemistry etc, etc, etc are considered Autistic and they live full normal lives.
            You are thinking of those people with serious developmental disorders where they do not progress past the age of 2, which is when we usually are able to see the first signs of Autism. Hence, people like you with limited understanding(intelligence) conclude that it must be due to vaccines.

          • AutismDadd

            Quite the brainfart . Make it up all by yourself?

          • Moss Quito

            No moron, again you prove your stupidity. DO some research on atypical autism or just the Autism spectrum. I spent 15 years of my life teaching adults with autism or on the spectrum. From those with violence to those people who simply couldn’t interact to social cues etc.
            Here are some ppl you might know all on the Spectrum…
            Dan Arkroyd.
            Wolfgang Amadeus Mozart.
            James Durbin.
            Daryl Hannah.
            Tim Burton.
            Andy Warhol.
            Dan Harmon. …
            Marty Balin. …
            Lewis Carroll.

          • AutismDadd

            Bull. Show me their diagnosis information

          • sabelmouse

            lol!

          • AutismDadd

            It means BIAS. You are one of those with autism that doesn’t want to accept you were born fine, then made autistic via vaccination.

          • Moss Quito

            That is without any doubt the stupidest comment I have ever seen.
            You cannot be made autistic, as it is a genetic disease..but lets forget that and focus on the stupidity you were born with..genetic or not?

          • AutismDadd

            Well you just made a more stupid comment claiming autism is a genetic disease. What a loser.

          • Denise

            You should listen (reread) to yourself. Coo coo ca choo. Just a bully with nothing interesting to say.

          • AutismDadd

            Then you must be as dense as moss

          • 655321

            Coming from you, that’s a solid compliment for AD.

          • AutismDadd

            moss is a Neanderthal

          • AutismDadd

            So what about those who have degrees in science, medicine etc who are critical of vaccines? I’m sure you’re saying ONLY believe vaccine proponents and no one else.

          • Moss Quito

            There are scientists who believe that the Earth is flat, 6000 years old, that the craters on the moon are from jets of water shooting up during the flood. There are scientists who believe that evolution is unproven and they are brain surgeons (Ben Carson). Just because 1 out of a 1000 say that vaccines are bad etc doesn’t make them right.
            What you fail to mention is that many of these so called medical/vaccine experts sell natural products, etc. Wakefield himself tried to discredit vaccines so he could sell his own version. Go look at all your idols of the anti vaxx crowd, they are selling ridiculous products at inflated prices. They sell items that have all the ingredients that they claim are terrible in vaccines..but are good their own product..

          • AutismDadd

            Oh blah blah blah….gotcha

          • Moss Quito

            Got me how? By proving you are a total moron over and over again? Sure.

          • AutismDadd

            Has Mom took the rubber sheets off the bed yet?

          • Moss Quito

            Took?
            What is it with you, with all the lying? Obviously the insults are because you haven’t a clue about the subject matter. I have tried to help you but you’re regressing now.
            Just stop lying or maybe you are just seeking attention..is this your way of getting daddy to spank you.

          • AutismDadd

            So the rubber sheets are still being used then.

          • Moss Quito

            Still waiting for evidence…and grow up. Insults from the creche, really?

          • AutismDadd

            Lots of people wet the bed. What have you tried to help stop?

          • Moss Quito

            I’m intrigued to know how you would feel if a Cancer vaccine, AIDS vaccine or Dementia vaccine was developed. Would you be for it, or against it?

          • AutismDadd

            When its reality I’ll answer

          • Moss Quito

            LOL. Pathetic.

          • AutismDadd

            Yes you are

          • AutismDadd

            Please don’t show me yours, not into that…ew

          • Moss Quito

            Evidence of how your mind works. BTW still waiting for your evidence on vaccines or maybe you can borrow Sabel mouses.

          • AutismDadd

            What evidence would make you believe?

          • Moss Quito

            Simple. Peer reviewed evidence from an accredited university or medical school. You will claim that there are many anti vax Dr’s who have published but that is not true..none of them have had a peer rev’d paper…proof of my claim? http://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/75b2fc463e74d3b457141539e2e16918e55911f666ed7db3b102d162f34dcee0.png

          • Moss Quito

            Last one. Your Truther Vaxx Doctors all have one thing in common they claim Big Pharma are only in it for the money…unlike them..reality ——–> http://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/e1be662e8a8020407ca07c2a1f519501c728be6538f8de205a39d99aa3a6dd7a.png

          • AutismDadd

            What crap. Its like fighting an unarmed man

          • Moss Quito

            Well I give you reams of factual information conducted under stringent scientific condition’s and you give..nada, zip, zero. You are almost right. One of us offers evidence the other (you) offers bullshit and flagging comments.

            BTW found that Evidence for your claims yet?

          • AutismDadd

            You offer plopaganda

          • Moss Quito

            At least I’m offering something..unlike you who offers platitudes and lies.

          • AutismDadd

            What platitudes and lies would those be?

          • tomonthebay

            He can’t give you what does not exist.

          • Moss Quito

            No. These ppl state clearly that they have done years of research. Years & years of research. It’s just that it all exists in a secret anti vaxxer vault..we shills are not allowed to see into the vault.

          • AutismDadd

            And you people claim 10,000 to 100,000 studies exist proving whatever crapola you are pushing. Even Offit claims 17 studies while CDC at a congressional hearing was unsure if it was 3 then said one vac vs unvac study. So quit flapping your lips and do some REAL research.

          • AutismDadd

            Is your whole belief system based on conspiracies?

          • Moss Quito

            I don’t believe in any conspiracies..you do. You have called me a Shill for big pharma on 9 occasions. It’s your go to claim in all your convo’s on here.

            When I say you’re a Flat earther it’s because you’re that stupid.

          • AutismDadd

            So you can’t even own up to all the conspiracy you claim is going on. Nutter alert!

          • Moss Quito

            What? What are you on? What conspiracies do I claim is going on…I know of none I believe in or endorse. So you’re a blatant liar.

          • AutismDadd

            Nutter siting

          • Moss Quito

            A what now? What conspiracies do I adhere to? Tell me..you can’t just lie and then call me names. That is toddler debating..give me your EVIDENCE, PROOF to support your arguments<—-stop lying, it just makes you look petty.

          • AutismDadd

            Are you an alcoholic?

          • Moss Quito

            LMAO. Seriously. Your best insult is to ask if I’m a drunk.

            Still waiting for all your research…

          • AutismDadd

            Well you do sound quite Effed up. Just wanted to advise you to seek help.

          • AutismDadd

            19 countries have vaccine injury compensation programs Inspector Clouseau. Tell us by what conspiracy they were all set up? Are they run by anti-vaxxers too?

          • Moss Quito

            You mean medical liabilities insurance.

            Your wanton stupidity is brilliant. A shining example of Walter Mitty daydreaming.

            There is a very small % of the population who may suffer reaction to vaccines. If you could read Vaccine inserts you would understand that.
            There are people the world over who are allergic to everything from pollen to latex so reactions are negligible to deadly.
            Councils throughout the land have funds for ppl who suffer injuries walking on council run pavements, or for cars who are damaged by poor road surfaces. So of course they have medical liabilities insurance.
            Why are you so ridiculous.

            Found that evidence for your antivaxx stance yet?

          • AutismDadd

            What a clown.

          • Moss Quito

            No comeback? You didn’t think of Medical liabilities insurance did you..that is because you are an idiot.

          • AutismDadd

            No. because its wrong and you are stupid in 19 languages.

          • Denise

            If you think close to 1 million injuries per year is a “very small % of the population”, then your in an alternate reality.

          • Larry Warshauer

            Have you watched the 9 part series on vaccination?. Have you seen Vaxed?. I think you are being ill informed. Watch the movies and see if you still trust the wisdom of the government mandating those vaccines to children or anyone for that matter

          • tomonthebay

            Vaxed??? Really? Featuring proven fraudulent researcher Andrew Wakefield. You have got to be kidding. When it comes to vaccinations I put my money where my mouth is. I get mine routinely. Flu vaccine in a few weeks and most likely the shingles vaccine as well.

          • Denise

            How about statistics? By 2025, 1 in 2 children will have some behavioral or autism spectrum disorder and 80% of them will by boys. That should raise red flags for anyone. What do all children across all demographics have in common, vaccines. In addition, your comment about correlation is not causation is misleading. In science it may not be causation, but it is highly probable. And then there is cause and effect. Defined: “Causality is the natural or worldly agency or efficacy that connects one process with another process or state, where the first is partly responsible for the second, and the second is partly dependent on the first.”

          • tomonthebay

            1 in 2 by 2025. Balderdash.

          • dang it

            Do you know what the rate is now? CDC put it at 1 in 45. In the 1970’s, the rate was 1 in 10,000.

          • tomonthebay

            And lots of questions about the validity of the statistics from the 70’s and questions about the numbers today as well.

          • AutismDadd

            And you evidence is …where?

          • Gerie

            Absolutely, Suki49

          • Aaron Weizmann

            Or of hiding the truth.

          • sabelmouse

            like with vaccines?

          • tomonthebay

            Actually vaccines have been challenge tested and proven to work in animals, not just proven with overwhelming correlation. Learn some actual science some time. It will help you understand the world we live in better.

          • sabelmouse

            it’s certainly been established that injecting neurotoxins into mice causes alzheimers and other issues. sadly that stops nobody from injecting those into humans.
            as for the rest ROLFMAO and i really can’t afford that with my pain and mobility issues.

          • tomonthebay

            Vaccines are NOT neurotoxins. Do you have an education beyond a GED?

          • sabelmouse

            mercury and aluminum are.
            you discredit yourself.

          • tomonthebay

            Like all toxins, the effects are dose related. The amount of thimerosal and aluminum hydroxide in vaccines were and are well below the threshold necessary to cause toxicity. There is far more aluminum hydroxide in a single dose of antacid than in any vaccine. I did actual research on toxicity at the National Center for Toxicological Research, have a pharmacy degree and and a Ph.D. in Pharmaceutics. It is an area I have actual expertise in, not just a little bit of information gotten off the internet.

          • sabelmouse

            more blah from you!

          • tomonthebay

            In short, you haven’t a clue.

          • sabelmouse

            you are a candidate for blocking, ain’t ya?

          • tomonthebay

            Knock yourself out. Everybody else will still get to see my responses.

          • sabelmouse

            but i won’t. that’es the benefit. they can look or block as they please.
            i’ve blocked a few shills and recommend it.

          • tomonthebay

            Whatever makes you happy.

          • sabelmouse

            thank you. it’s certainly more peaceful and some of the profile photos are also best not seen.

          • Thomas Cannon

            I blocked this moron a long time ago. He posts nothing but pure moronic BS nonsense, and it’s a complete waste of time, to even see his posts, let alone read any of them. LOL

          • AutismDadd

            Shill manual sighted.

          • AutismDadd

            So indoctrinated. Are you copying a textbook or Merck Manual?

          • tomonthebay

            No, I have just taken a courses in pharmacology and toxicology and have also done a stint as a visiting scientist at the National Center for Toxicological Research. In short, I have actual knowledge and experience in the field of toxicology, in significant contrast to you.

          • AutismDadd

            So you know how toxic things are and can protect yourself and you family, but you’d keep quiet to keep your job…real nice

          • tomonthebay

            My family and I protect ourselves by taking advantage of all the things that modern medicine offers and we have all had our vaccinations. I will be getting my flu vaccine in the next few weeks. So will my MD brothers.

          • AutismDadd

            MD brothers…bring me a bucket

          • tomonthebay

            Both of my brothers are in fact MD’s. I have a Ph.D. in addition to my pharmacy degree. My father was a pharmacist, my mother a nurse. You might want to take that bucket off your head.

          • AutismDadd

            So how many patients has you family killed? Isn’t mainstream medicine 3rd ranked in causes of death?

          • tomonthebay

            The interventional cardiologist saves lives on a near daily basis. The oncologist has a much tougher row to hoe. Both have outstanding reputations. Unfortunately for all of us there are systemic issues in medical practice that can and do cause medical errors with bad consequences. I have yet to meet a doctor that hasn’t made mistakes. I have met a number of them seem to believe that they have never made a mistake. Most of them are surgeons. In spite of those issues I will still trust my care to physicians before I would ever trust my care to so-called alternative providers. By the way, they, their wives, and their children all get vaccinated.

          • AutismDadd

            Good for them. Any autism in the family tree?

          • tomonthebay

            Not that I am aware of. If there were there is no actual evidence of linkage to vaccines.

          • AutismDadd

            None that’s honestly and consistently admitted that is. Not to mention little is known about how it develops, but an environmental trigger (guess what the trigger is) is involved, based on SCIENCE and EXPERTS

          • tomonthebay

            Far from accepted science.

          • AutismDadd

            No its the actual world of science and how it operates.

          • tomonthebay

            Looking at the actual published papers and summaries of same the environmental factors linked as possible, emphasis on possible, the leading candidates were a couple of drugs, certain types of pesticides, and endocrine disruptors, and certain infections. All of them are proposed to be in utero exposure and NO vaccines are implicated. At this point none of this is proven science and genetic predisposition is strongly implicated as well. Ironically, rubella is one of the infections that there is a link to, a disease that can be prevented by vaccination.

          • AutismDadd

            The genetic predisposition isn’t strong. It flopped. Its time to admit we don’t know far more than we know. Speculation and supposition isn’t evidence. No study proves anything and implying they do means nothing.

          • Bored Now

            The genetic predisposition isn’t strong.

            If it wasn’t strong you wouldn’t see a significant difference between monozygotic and dizygotic twin studies. You do, so it is.

            Welcome to how science is actually done.

          • Dip

            It’s not exclusive, though, hence why you do have situations where one identical twin is autistic and another isn’t.

            Again, welcome to how science is done.

            (This is for Adad, not you)

          • AutismDadd

            New namr Dip/Dipshit/ justthefacts?

          • 655321

            Weak. Sounds like you have a family of well trained industry doggies who haven’t the soul or the courage to reconcile the damage they’ve caused real people.

          • Ron Roy

            You lie like a rug.

          • tomonthebay

            How so? My family does exactly what I stated. I will get my flu vaccine in the next few weeks and will be checking in to the insurance coverage on the shingles vaccine as well. My wife will get her flue vaccines. My MD brothers and their wives (one a nurse, the other an MD herself) will also get the flu vaccine again this year just like last year and years previous. Isn’t it amazing that those of us who actually have an medical education all get vaccinated? /s

          • Ron Roy

            ”According to the most recent data from the Centers for Disease Control
            and Prevention, a significant chunk of health care professionals
            declined to get vaccinated
            against the influenza virus during the 2006-07 flu season, with only
            about 40 percent opting for a jab.”

            ”There are in fact, more than 22,000 nurses, part of Nurses against Mandatory Vaccines (NAMV), who are refusing mandatory vaccines.
            NAMV was founded when mandatory vaccines were introduced in the
            workplace, and though it is not pro-vaccine OR anti-vaccine, it is
            certainly pro-CHOICE. NAMV members believe that all people should have
            the right to choose and refuse medical treatment, including nurses and healthcare workers.”

          • 655321

            Whats amazing is that you write nonsense like this as if it has any scientific value. You continuously try to offer opinions and agency statements as some sort of scientific evidence, like the good little doggy you were trained to be.

          • AutismDadd

            Or lose their jobs?

          • AutismDadd

            This new shill tomonthetake is a sock puppet.

          • Ron Roy

            ”have a pharmacy degree and and a Ph.D. in Pharmaceutics” Oh then perhaps you can tell me why local pharmacists admit to never taking the flu shot.

          • tomonthebay

            Not the pharmacists I know.

          • Gerie

            Absolutely, sabelmouse, And especially when injected… You’ve obviously done your homework… I refuse any longer to respond directly to the statements of the tomonthe..etc.. person.. and others who refuse to look at all the evidence. SO much MISINFORMATION has been intentionally distributed by CDC and the vaccine industry…

          • sabelmouse

            i’ve blocked a good view of them . makes it more peaceful.

          • AutismDadd

            tom is on something

          • tomonthebay

            Yes, it is called education and understanding of basic science.

          • AutismDadd

            I thought maybe Jim Beam and uppers

          • tomonthebay

            You should probably cut back on both.

          • AutismDadd

            LMFAO me? Profection 101

          • tomonthebay

            Your understanding of basic biology and medicine is matched by your typing/spelling skills.

          • AutismDadd

            You’re too kind, thank you. Wish I could say something positive about you….ah..hmm got nothing

          • tomonthebay

            Ahhhh, I am so hurt.

          • AutismDadd

            LMFAO

          • Ben

            Mike Stevens takes it up the bootie by by red-headed Johnathan, who always gives a reach-around✒*alωays*.

            He either calls it getting “gingered”, “contracting smallcox“, or “performing the Philadelphia Experiment.”

          • Gerie

            You and I and countless others know vaccines are harming so many. SO many chronic diseases, children and adults.

          • sabelmouse

            yes! but that’s just nature being evil, nothing to do with man made toxins.

          • Bored Now

            t’s certainly been established that injecting neurotoxins into mice causes alzheimers

            Oh? Do tell.

          • Ben

            Histological (true) Alzheimer’s is characterized by neurofibrillary tangles. The presence of these was both sufficient and necessary to classically diagnose Alzheimer’s. Since these tangles form the true and historical diagnostic basis of Alzheimer’s, you could almost say that they are Alzheimer’s.

            Aluminum was the first thing—and perhaps only thing—shown to do this in animals.

            The injection of aluminum has been shown to produce neurofibrillary tangles. The same histological features would lead to an Alzheimer’s diagnosis in a human.

            Besides the obvious clinical-toxicological and epidemiological proof that aluminum can do this, other researchers look into low acetylcholine levels. Low levels of acetylcholine receptors are also a common finding, and smokers always have less Alzheimers. Nicotine upregulates acetylcholine receptors.

            Homocysteine, derived from methionine, can form a stable free radical which readily crosses the blood–brain barrier. The leads to lipid peroxidation, malondialdehyde, the subsequent and obligatory lysyl-crosslinks, and—most likely—neurofibrillary tangles. This process has also been shown experimentally to either destroy or inhibit acetylcholine synthesase. This could be the connection between lipid peroxidation and acetylcholine (cholinergic hypothesis).

            So aluminum and homocysteine are the two biggest causes, and both cause lipid peroxidation. Aluminum does this by displacing iron. Free iron is what actually does this, through the well-known Fenton reactions.

            Homocysteine—but not cysteine, nor methionine—can form a free radical through it’s interaction with its own amino group. This molecule has one carbon longer than cysteine, so it can bend to reach the amino group—extracting a proton. The amino group then itself takes a proton from the tertiary α-carbon forming a stable free radical.

            Using subterfuge to sneak across the blood brain barrier, spartathiol homocysteine—after gaining entry like a Trojan horse—then plucks a proton off an alkene initiating a free radical lipid peroxidation cascade culminating in the formation of protein-crosslinking highly-reactive aldehydes and dialdehydes such as—but not limited to—hydroxynonenal. and malondialdehyde with subsequent neurofibriallary tangle formation (i.e. histological Alzheimer’s).

            http://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/cfa67a84c2d604c4a3cefd04ee8994d66a7743475ebd7a228399491d6425725d.png

          • Ben

            Histological (true) Alzheimer’s is characterized by neurofibrillary tangles. The presence of these was both sufficient and necessary to classically diagnose Alzheimer’s. Since these tangles form the true and historical diagnostic basis of Alzheimer’s, you could almost say that they are Alzheimer’s.

            Aluminum was the first thing—and perhaps only thing—shown to do this in animals.

            The injection of aluminum has been shown to produce neurofibrillary tangles. The same histological features would lead to an Alzheimer’s diagnosis in a human.

            Besides the obvious clinical-toxicological and epidemiological proof that aluminum can do this, other researchers look into low acetylcholine levels. Low levels of acetylcholine receptors are also a common finding, and smokers always have less Alzheimers. Nicotine upregulates acetylcholine receptors.

            Homocysteine, derived from methionine, can form a stable free radical which readily crosses the blood–brain barrier. The leads to lipid peroxidation, malondialdehyde, the subsequent and obligatory lysyl-crosslinks, and—most likely—neurofibrillary tangles. This process has also been shown experimentally to either destroy or inhibit acetylcholine synthesase. This could be the connection between lipid peroxidation and acetylcholine (cholinergic hypothesis).

            So aluminum and homocysteine are the two biggest causes, and both cause lipid peroxidation. Aluminum does this by displacing iron. Free iron is what actually does this, through the well-known Fenton reactions.

            Homocysteine—but not cysteine, nor methionine—can form a free radical through it’s interaction with its own amino group. This molecule has one carbon longer than cysteine, so it can bend to reach the amino group—extracting a hyrogen. The amino group then itself takes a hydrogen from the tertiary α-carbon forming a stable free radical.
            Using subterfuge to sneak across the blood brain barrier, spartathiol homocysteine—after gaining entry like a Trojan horse—then plucks a proton off an alkene initiating a free radical lipid peroxidation cascade culminating in the formation of protein-crosslinking highly-reactive aldehydes and dialdehydes such as—but not limited to—hydroxynonenal. and malondialdehyde with subsequent neurofibriallary tangle formation (i.e. histological Alzheimer’s).

          • Bored Now

            Still lashing out eh? Always good to hear.

            Please supply the experimental evidence showing mice with Alzheimers. Thanks. 🙂 You have three posts to supply this. Thanks. 🙂

          • Ben

            Do you think I give a dαmn about your stupid limit?

            Please supply the experimental evidence showing mice with Alzheimers.

            Where have you been Jon? Lazy ignorant pig-headed bαstard:

            Yoshiyama, Yasumasa, et al. “Enhanced neurofibrillary tangle formation, cerebral atrophy, and cognitive deficits induced by repetitive mild brain injury in a transgenic tauopathy mouse model.” Journal of neurotrauma 22.10 (2005): 1134-1141.

            Kowall, N. W., et al. “Aluminum-induced neurofibrillary degeneration affects a subset of neurons in rabbit cerebral cortex, basal forebrain and upper brainstem.” Neuroscience 29.2 (1989): 329-337.

            Wisniewski, Henryk M., John A. Sturman, and Judy W. Shek. “Aluminum chloride induced neurofibrillary changes in the developing rabbit: a chronic animal model.” Annals of neurology 8.5 (1980): 479-490.

            Crapper, D. R., S. S. Krishnan, and A. J. Dalton. “Brain aluminum distribution in Alzheimer’s disease and experimental neurofibrillary degeneration.” Science 180.4085 (1973): 511-513.

            Aluminum causes neurofibrillary tangles in all animals tested. It even does this in humans:

            Walton, J. R. “Evidence for participation of aluminum in neurofibrillary tangle formation and growth in Alzheimer’s disease.” Journal of Alzheimer’s Disease 22.1 (2010): 65-72.

            Let me know if you want to hear more about the chemical mechanisms.

          • Bored Now

            Do you think I give a dαmn about your stupid limit?

            Yep, for example your need to address it says that and it’s a perfectly reasonable limit supported by research.

            Where have you been Jon? This has been known since the 1960s.

            This is always a fun bit of manipulation to deconstruct. You make a claim and then berate people for not being familiar with data that you think makes your point. Effectively you are saying that someone other than you should be responsible for making your own point. The fact that these actions feel good you you Travis should be something of a red flag.

            Since the claim was “mice” and the first two are rabbit studies and the last two are about humans? Are you saying that sablemouse was wrong? That seems like what you are saying.

            Just for reference here’s how human beings talk to each other:

            Sable is quite possibly overstating her case, I know of no studies that show neurological injury to mice and I know of no established murine model for Alzheimer’s but you might find these rabbit studies interesting as they show characteristic X which I believe to be a strong indicator of Y

            You have two posts left if you want to make a point about mice or clarify what you are trying to say about rabbits.

          • Ben

            The fact that I am pointing out it: Aluminum injections cause histological Alzheimer’s disease.

            Alzheimer’s was initially defined based on these neorofibrillary tangles. These tangles are Alzheimer’s.

            Aluminum causes Alzheimer’s in rabbits.

            Pretty simple Jon. I can’t see where you are having trouble with this.

          • Bored Now

            The fact that I am pointing out it

            That’s not really a cogent statement.

            I take it that you are saying that you have searched far and wide for research and it’s your considered opinion that sablemouse entirely fabricated her position that there’s any research showing Alzheimer’s developing in mice by injecting anything and so you consider my skepticism regarding her post rather well-founded.

            One post left. Do you have anything to say about mice?

            Alzheimer’s was initially defined based on these neorofibrillary tangles. These tangles are Alzheimer’s.

            Aluminum causes Alzheimer’s in rabbits.

            I confess, at times it’s difficult to tell if you’re deluded or duplicitous.

          • Ben

            One post left.

            ―Keep your girly games to yourself Jon. I told you once before, I don’t much care for your imaginary limits.

            Do you have anything to say about mice?

            ―Do you know how to read? There are dozens of studies showing learning deficits in mice fed, or injected with, aluminum.

            Now you’ve exhausted my tolerance for your annoying ginger-headedness. We can consider this conversation over:

            ➤ Ribes, D., et al. “Effects of oral aluminum exposure on behavior and neurogenesis in a transgenic mouse model of Alzheimer’s disease.” Experimental Neurology 214.2 (2008): 293-300.

            ➤ Rebai, Ouafa, and Nour Eddine Djebli. “Chronic exposure to aluminum chloride in mice: exploratory behaviors and spatial learning.” Advances in Biological Research 2.1-2 (2008): 26-33.

            ➤ Shaw, Christopher A., and Michael S. Petrik. “Aluminum hydroxide injections lead to motor deficits and motor neuron degeneration.” Journal of inorganic biochemistry 103.11 (2009): 1555-1562.

            ➤ Abu-Taweel, Gasem M., Jamaan S. Ajarem, and Mohammad Ahmad. “Neurobehavioral toxic effects of perinatal oral exposure to aluminum on the developmental motor reflexes, learning, memory and brain neurotransmitters of mice offspring.” Pharmacology Biochemistry and Behavior 101.1 (2012): 49-56.

            ➤ Zhang, Z., and C. X. Yu. “Effect of melatonin on learning and memory impairment induced by aluminum chloride and its mechanism.” Yao xue xue bao= Acta pharmaceutica Sinica 37.9 (2002): 682-686.

          • Bored Now

            I told you once before, I don’t much care for

            Actually you implied that you didn’t care. Now you’re saying you dislike it. To which the obvious response is: If you don’t want to be treated like a troll, don’t be a troll.

            your imaginary limits.

            They are quite real, which hs why you whine about them.

            Do you know how to read?

            Again with your “Every single person but me is responsible for supporting my points”.

            We can consider this conversation over:

            Seriously? You really think making a statement like that just before you get cut off is going to make you look anything other than infantile?

            I assume you simply blindly googled for your studies, so I’ll just read the first one. Let’s see:Effects of oral aluminum exposure on behavior and neurogenesis in a transgenic mouse model of Alzheimer’s disease. Ok these mice were fed….1 mg/g?! for 120 days?!

            Uh Travis….at 2 months over here a child get a DTap which has something like 0.6mg of Aluminum Hydroxide. At that point they are about 3Kg or 3000g. Meaning that they get a dose of about 0.6mg/3000g = 0.0002 or about 5000 times less than 1mg/g.

            And that’s just a few times spaced over months…those mice are receiving this dose every day. So that dose is way off – now clearly the study is attempting to emulate the exposure human population gets. However if this is accurate it’s unlikely that the amount in vaccines would make any difference.

            Anyway feel free to follow me around and nip at my heels some more. 🙂

          • AutismDadd

            Yawn. Same old

          • AutismDadd

            BOO

          • tomonthebay

            And your degrees are in????? You have been published in what scientific journals????? You went to what medical or pharmacy school???? Or do you have an “internet degree”?

          • AutismDadd

            This isn’t a dating site dude.

          • tomonthebay

            In short, you have no background or education to defend your position except for the “internet” degree. Thanks for the confirmation.

          • AutismDadd

            So take me on Mr huff and puff

          • Ben

            How the he‖ would you know, Arrogant Tom?

            You would think the above poster would know more about this than you do, yet you are implying that said victim would have gotten ALS anyway—regardless of vaccine.

            Doesn’t fly Tom. This is both arrogant and rude. And considering that vaccines have traditionally been associated with Guillain-Barré, I find your denials vapid.

            You’re empty space Tom.

          • tomonthebay

            Actually, there is no reason to think that the poster would know other than the coincidence of timing between a vaccination and a diagnosis. There is also no correlation between Guillain-Barre and ALS. You are the empty space Benny.

          • Ben

            Why would they correlate? They are both, somewhat, similar conditions.

            And how do you know said victim’s ALS wasn’t actually misdiagnosed Guillain-Barré? You don’t!

          • tomonthebay

            I think Sabel would know what the diagnosis was for his/her brother. I also can conclude that you are truly clueless Benny.

          • Ben

            A diagnosis is just a noun, Tom.

            ➞ Nkowane, Benjamin M., et al. “Vaccine-associated paralytic poliomyelitis: United States: 1973 through 1984.” Jama 257.10 (1987): 1335-1340.

            ➞ Haber, Penina, et al. “Vaccines and guillain-barre syndrome.” Drug Safety 32.4 (2009): 309-323.

            What’s in a name?

            “A vaccine-induced neurology by any other name would be just as debilitating.” ―Billy Shears

          • tomonthebay

            None of those have anything to do with ALS Benny. Your lack of medical knowledge and understanding are showing. Guess that Google Ph.D. isn’t worth much.

          • Ben

            The what Tom?

            Do you have a BS from Brownsville Community College, Tom?

            “The aetiology of most cases of ALS is unknown.”†

            Both Guillain-Barré syndrome and amyotrophic lateral sclerosis are motor neuropathies. Other types, such as porphyria and Kennedy’s disease, have true biochemical definitions (elevated porphyrin synthesis and androgen receptor polymorphism, respectively), but not these two. These two diseases are both motor neuropathies without hard definition.

            “This points to an important goal for clinicians dealing with ALS. It is imperative that we improve our diagnostic capabilities so that we can accurately identify ALS at an earlier time, and avoid the misdiagnoses that have been found in up to 40% of ALS patients.”‡

            You can split hairs and say: “Well, horn neurons are thought to be degenerated in ALS and GBS is more of a peripheral demyelinating condition.” You could even redefine them based on nerve amplitude.

            But it’s hard to find-out for sure without a biopsy, or an autopsy, if the horn cells are involved in each case.

            Not all facilities will have the most up-to-date diagnostic criteria, and there are always subjective biases among different diagnosticians.

            I don’t think that it’s as cut-and-dry as Tom want’s us to believe. Doctor Hosokawa doesn’t seem to think so, and has actively conducted studies on the differential diagnosis between these two conditions. Apparently, there is still a need to differentiate between these two conditions.

            “There is as yet no other widely accepted protocol for laboratory testing, and ALS at onset may mimic several disorders, some of which are treatable.Guillain–Barre syndrome (GBS) is one such disease in ´which the essential pathology is inflammatory demyelinatingpolyneuropathy and axonopathy that principallyaffect motor nerves. Early symptoms of ALS and GBS vary among patients, but they usually begin with muscle weakness.”§

            He tested the cerebospinal with antibodies for TAR DNA-binding protein.* He found slightly-higher levels in ALS. He goes on to say:
            “While CSF TDP-43 measurement by sandwich ELISA seems to be a promising strategy for the development of a laboratory test that helps clinically differentiate ALS from GBS…”§

            So Tom, I repeat, just because these two conditions have different names does not mean that only one can be caused by a vaccine. And even if this were true—that only GBS is caused by vaccines—there are misdiagnosis that would complicate things. Vaccine-inducedGuillain-Barré syndrome could potentially be diagnosed as amyotrophic lateral sclerosis. Only a fool, or someone with an agenda, would say otherwise.

            Victim’s relative says victim acquired ALS from vaccine. This is plausible enough not to discount it, not a stretch of the imagination. It’s rude and insulting to deny this out-of-hand, since ALS does not even have a properly-defined etiology.

            † Léger, J‐M., and F. Salachas. “Diagnosis of motor neuropathy.” European journal of neurology 8.3 (2001): 201-208.

            ‡ Belsh, Jerry M. “ALS diagnostic criteria of El Escorial Revisited: do they meet the needs of clinicians as well as researchers?.” Amyotrophic Lateral Sclerosis and Other Motor Neuron Disorders 1.sup1 (2000): S57-S60.

            § Hosokawa, Masato, et al. “Differential diagnosis of amyotrophic lateral sclerosis from Guillain–Barré syndrome by quantitative determination of TDP-43 in cerebrospinal fluid.” International Journal of Neuroscience 124.5 (2014): 344-349.

          • Ben

            The what Tom?

            Do you have a BS from Brownsville Community College, Tom?

            ➞ “The aetiology of most cases of ALS is unknown.”†

            Both Guillain-Barré syndrome and amyotrophic lateral sclerosis are motor neuropathies. Other types, such as porphyria and Kennedy’s disease, have true biochemical definitions (elevated porphyrin synthesis and androgen receptor polymorphism, respectively), but not these two. These two diseases are both motor neuropathies without hard definition.

            ➞ “This points to an important goal for clinicians dealing with ALS. It is imperative that we improve our diagnostic capabilities so that we can accurately identify ALS at an earlier time, and avoid the misdiagnoses that have been found in up to 40% of ALS patients.”‡

            You can split hairs and say: “Well, horn neurons are thought to be degenerated in ALS and GBS is more of a peripheral demyelinating condition.” You could even redefine them based on nerve amplitude.

            But it’s hard to find-out for sure without a biopsy, or an autopsy, if the horn cells are involved in each case.

            Not all facilities will have the most up-to-date diagnostic criteria, and there are always subjective biases among different diagnosticians.

            I don’t think that it’s as cut-and-dry as Tom want’s us to believe. Doctor Hosokawa doesn’t seem to think so, and has actively conducted studies on the differential diagnosis between these two conditions. Apparently, there is still a need to differentiate between these two conditions.

            ➞ “There is as yet no other widely accepted protocol for laboratory testing, and ALS at onset may mimic several disorders, some of which are treatable.Guillain–Barre syndrome (GBS) is one such disease in ´which the essential pathology is inflammatory demyelinating polyneuropathy and axonopathy that principally affect motor nerves. Early symptoms of ALS and GBS vary among patients, but they usually begin with muscle weakness.”§

            He tested the cerebospinal with antibodies for TAR DNA-binding protein.* He found slightly-higher levels in ALS. He goes on to say:

            ➞ “While CSF TDP-43 measurement by sandwich ELISA seems to be a promising strategy for the development of a laboratory test that helps clinically differentiate ALS from GBS…”§

            So Tom, I repeat, just because these two conditions have different names does not mean that only one can be caused by a vaccine. And even if this were true—that only GBS is caused by vaccines—there are misdiagnosis that would complicate things. Vaccine-induced Guillain-Barré syndrome could potentially be diagnosed as amyotrophic lateral sclerosis. Only a fool, or someone with an agenda, would say otherwise.

            Victim’s relative says victim acquired ALS from vaccine. This is plausible enough not to discount it, not a stretch of the imagination. It’s rude and insulting to deny this out-of-hand, since ALS does not even have a properly-defined etiology.

            † Léger, J‐M., and F. Salachas. “Diagnosis of motor neuropathy.” European journal of neurology 8.3 (2001): 201-208.
            ‡ Belsh, Jerry M. “ALS diagnostic criteria of El Escorial Revisited: do they meet the needs of clinicians as well as researchers?.” Amyotrophic Lateral Sclerosis and Other Motor Neuron Disorders 1.sup1 (2000): S57-S60.
            § Hosokawa, Masato, et al. “Differential diagnosis of amyotrophic lateral sclerosis from Guillain–Barré syndrome by quantitative determination of TDP-43 in cerebrospinal fluid.” International Journal of Neuroscience 124.5 (2014): 344-349.

          • tomonthebay

            Last response to your lunacy. Victim’s relative says victim got ALS from vaccine in NO way makes that plausible. I have seen NO plausible links between TDap vaccination and ALS and neither have you. Bye bye fundamentalist zealot.

          • Ben

            Moron: You just heard about a link between the TDap vaccine and ALS.

          • tomonthebay

            None of the studies you posted have anything to do with TDap and ALS. Done with your nonsense. You may type to yourself all you want.

          • Ben

            Moron: Poster’s brother got TDap and then ALS onset in quick succession.

            Do you get paid to abuse vaccine victims Tom? I can show you a entire list of legal cases if you’d like. Would that make vaccine injury seem more “real” to you?

          • tomonthebay

            You are the one who id cognitively impaired. It is called a coincidence. There is no substantive link between TDaP and ALS. The only question I have left for you is are you really that dumb or do you have some kind of personality disorder. I will not waste any more time on you.

          • Ben

            You are the one who id cognitively impaired. It is called a coincidence.

            It’s called irony, with your typo and all.

            You’re not qualified to say this is a “coincidence.” Nobody is.

            If you hadn’t get the memo (they have been showing this since the 1960s), aluminum causes lipid peroxidation in the brain by displacing iron. Vaccine-derived aluminum hydroxide nanoparticles have been experimentally-shown to travel to the brain via macrophage. There will, of course, be aluminum ions which slowly dissociate from the site-of-injection. These can travel to the brain as well.

            Amyotrophic lateral sclerosis has undefined etiology. Also, Guillain-Barré can be misdiagnosed as amyotrophic lateral sclerosis. You have no idea who diagnosed the ALS, therefor you cannot say for certain that victim truly has “ALS.”

            Guillain-Barré has been legally-determined to have been caused by vaccines.

            The use of aluminum salts in vaccines is criminal. Calcium salts can, and have, been used instead.

          • AutismDadd

            Oh the COINCIDENCE explanation. Yea there’s some rocket science for you…

          • AutismDadd

            tomonthetake only wants to have his say, NOT here to debate. Typical shill minion.

          • 655321

            Are you saying it’s wrong to make statements without providing evidence?

          • AutismDadd

            No, because I’d be a hypocrite.

          • 655321

            Lol, was kidding.

          • AutismDadd

            But I’m right about me.

          • 655321

            Is Mikey Stevens still shilling these boards? Hes avoiding me when he can.

          • AutismDadd

            He won’t reply to me. FalseAngel won’t either.

          • Mike Stevens

            He’s really woeful on medical issues. Chemistry he can do a bit, but medicine..Nah. He just makes it up as he goes along. Math too, usually.

          • Gerie

            Thanks for your bravery in continuing to post the truth. You and I and tens of thousands, perhaps many more, know and continue to learn the horrors that are being covered up by the vaccine industry and CDC. The Vaccine industry is huge trillion dollar industry and will do everything in its power to suppress truth tellers such as you, @Suki49:disqus. I try not to continue responding to these total naysayers here, who out of ignorance will not explore the prolific science showing the truth about vaccines, OR (and most likely), are among the many who are paid by the vaccine industry and vaccine unit of CDC to continue their trolling on sites such as this..

          • Aaron Weizmann

            Yes, proof. Not only that Suki’s
            accusations ARE nonsense, but also proof that they are NOT nonsense.
            The research has been shown to be lacking, either by negligence or
            for a darker motive. The article rightly asks why not do the
            research, “what are you afraid of?” Prove Suki’s wrong or that
            she’s right– STOP PUTTING OFF PROVIDING THE NECESSARY EVIDENCE AND
            PROVE IT!!

          • tomonthebay

            Who is stopping the research you are talking about? The evidence for the effectiveness of vaccines is overwhelming and has been out there for decades and decades going all the way back to Jenner and the use of cowpox to prevent smallpox. Thanks to vaccines smallpox has been eradicated, polio is largely non-existent in the modern world, measles and rubella have been drastically decreased. Rabies in our pets is non-issue. I hope a human vaccine for Lyme’s becomes available soon as I have already had one probable case, caught early and treated immediately, but a constant threat when I am in the outdoors here in Wisconsin. If I go visit Africa again, if I am in a yellow fever area I will get vaccinated. I keep my tetanus vaccinations up to date even though that shot hurts like the devil.

            By the way, where do I go to get paid to defend vaccinations? I just retired and would love to have a new revenue stream.

          • AutismDadd

            Contact CDC, although you already know that.

          • AutismDadd

            So you can prove him wrong? Go ahead

          • AutismDadd

            Denial all you have?

          • Ron Roy

            You’re the one spreading nonsense.

          • tomonthebay

            Another zealot from the church of no vaccines.

    • Gerie

      Totally agree..

  • Rene

    Absolutely this research and testing is so important. Should have been standard protocol from the get-go, but of course everything has been done backwards because the CDC owns something in the ballpark of dozens and dozens (something like 50 vaccine patents.) So I say let’s keep the CDC out of it and have the data collected and protected and provided to the public as well health professionals.
    vaccines. Between the CDC the FDA, pharmaceutical conglomerates and lobbyists in Washington and completely immoral politicians are all in the business of Distributing and profiting from these vaccines in one way or the other.

    • Gerie

      And the vaccine industry is a $Trillion industry, yes, with $$ going back to the Vaccine part of CDC. Much documentation about all this in The Truth About Vaccines and other documentaries in recent months and years.

  • Carl Watts

    #Vaccines are part of depopulation…ask billgates! #KnowledgeIsPower!#AwesomeTeam☮

    • Cassandra S. Dunn

      Vaccines are designed to infect, disable and kill. The no liability gave them free range on our babies for profit.

    • Kulu Sadira

      I don’t have access to B Gates. What was his reply when you asked him?

    • tomonthebay

      Wow. Look how successful at depopulation they have been. We are closing in on 8 billion and climbing.

  • Cassandra S. Dunn

    There is no safe vaccine. There is no safer schedule. They are most made In China with little to no oversight and they are all contaminated. (Nagalase enzyme, cancer virus, Glyphosate, HCG, glass, mycoplasmas, amoebas, spirochetes, lead, reverse transcriptase, etc..). They are designed to infect, disable and kill. Every vaccine causes brain damage. They are a lobotomy in a syringe. 13 scientists have come out of the CDC in the past years with their ethics or fraudulent studies concerns. USA is the most vaccinated country with the most chronically ill children. One in 11 boys is on the autism spectrum disorder. Vaccines are also changing our DNA! We are one generation away from genetic and immune collapse!! Protect your babies! SAY NO TO ALL VACCINES! Peds/MD’s make money selling vaccines as they are the “Salesmen”. The CDC is a “Cesspool of corruption” (Kennedy) and is a for profit vaccine CORPORATION with no liability. The vaccine agenda is an evil one and must be stopped!

    • Kulu Sadira

      It would be illuminating to see if any stats exist on percentage of autistic boys in poor/UNvaccinated countries in Africa, Asia and Latin America… Anyone? Granted, this would again show the possibility of correlation, not causation.

      • Gerie

        Yes, it would!

      • ILoveJellybeans

        Unfortunately such a statistic is not likely to exist. A diagnosis of autism, to be counted in the statistics or be relevant to a scientific paper, must be diagnosed by a medical professional such as a psychologist. Especially as when it comes to people in a different culture, where there might be a language barrier or different cultural norms making it difficult to work out who is autistic (especially with the people with less obvious traits), such as in some cultures, eye contact is rude.
        .
        People in developing countries aren’t unvaccinated by choice, in fact, if vaccines are made available, like if someone comes from another country with a delivery of medical supplies, people are willing to go and get them. Its a lack of access to medical care that is an issue for both whether they get vaccines, or whether they are able to get an autism diagnosis.
        .
        There isn’t a country where access to medical care is good enough that people are able to take their kid for an autism assessment (with today’s diagnostic criteria) because they are concerned about their development, but vaccines aren’t a thing.

    • Mike Stevens

      Truly wonderful.
      Definitely a keeper…

  • Barbara Wreesmann

    vaccine adjuvants are mercury, aluminum, formaldehyde, egg cells, and other metals. you are injecting that into your body when you inject vaccines. its noit just the vaccines, which also can hurt you. some bodies do not take vaccines well and you get sick or die

    • Gerie

      Yes… and it’s the adjuvants that allow for easier blood-brain crossing, thus affecting the entire nervous system, and more. It’s criminal… and then to say we have no choice?!

    • It’s ALL poison, and, as Dr. Andrew Moulden proclaimed, “All vaccines produce harm.”

      Even to the people who don’t think they are harmed. Being a sickly child with severe allergies or disabilities is the NEW NORMAL. Childhood cancer and leukemia has soared, and parents aren’t connecting the dots. So many autoimmune diseases manifesting down the road. It’s criminal.

      • Gerie

        Yes… beyond criminal.. and Congress has been so duped, so bought by Pharma/vaccine lobby… We MUST change that.. open their eyes somehow.. Dr. William Thompson must be kept safe, and there must be Congressional hearings where he can show his proof of how the studies in the early 2000’s were altered, by his bosses, to show no correlation. Of course, there’s huge correlation..

    • Gerie

      Agree.

    • ILoveJellybeans

      Hi, actually this is incorrect. Only one of those ingredients is an adjuvant in vaccines. Some of the substances you mentioned are or have been used in vaccines, but not as an adjuvant. An adjuvant enhances the immune response-the killed/weakened/bits of virus are very weak (they have to be, so they cannot cause the illness).
      .
      Aluminium (in a compound, as a salt) is the adjuvant.
      Its nothing to worry about though, aluminium is everywhere, the amount in vaccines is nothing compared to the amount people get over their lifetime, from dietary sources (its even found in human breastmilk and baby formula), the air we breathe and in water. The body is good at excreting this, and studies have shown that even immediately after vaccination, the amount of aluminium in the body never reaches unsafe levels, and it is excreted quickly.
      .
      Mercury, or rather, thimerosal, which is a compound that contains some mercury, but not in metal form was used as a preservative in multi dose vials, this prevents the vaccine from becoming contaminated by bacteria. Nowadays, most vaccines are in single dose vials, with no thimerosal needed. The only vaccines that contain thimerosal are some flu shots (about 30%). You get more mercury from eating tuna than you do from a vaccine.
      .
      Formaldehyde is another scary sounding chemical that isn’t so bad. It is used in the production of the vaccine, but most of it is removed, only the tiniest little trace amounts remain.
      Its abundant in the food we eat, its found in a lot of fruit and vegetables (including bananas, potatoes, carrots, pears, apples), in meat, seafood and dairy. You get the equivalent of around 585 vaccines worth in just one pear. Did you know, the human body is always creating small amounts of formaldehyde, as a byproduct of our normal functions, and there is way more in your blood right now than from any vaccine.
      .
      Egg cells are used in the manufacturing process in some vaccines. The weakened virus used in the vaccine needs to replicate, and for this, it needs some cells to grow in. The virus is then taken out of the egg, and purified, before being made into a vaccine. Eggs aren’t harmful, but if youre severely allergic you should check first with the doctor.
      .
      Each vaccine has a list of contraindications, and the people on this list are the ones who should not receive that vaccine. It is important that the people who can take the vaccines do so, to protect those people who have bodies that are unable to take certain vaccines.
      .
      The only way someone can get a virus is to get in contact with someone who is infected, as a virus needs a host to do its thing. If most people are immune to the virus, the virus cannot move from person to person, and then eventually it will die. This is the goal of vaccination, for the virus to not be able to spread, and die out. Then the vaccine will not be needed, like with smallpox. Humanity wiped it off the face of the planet, and now nobody can catch it, and it was dropped from the vaccine schedule.

      • Barbara Wreesmann

        wrong wrong wrong sorry.

        • ILoveJellybeans

          What part is wrong, and what evidence do you have to prove it?

  • Larry Warshauer

    All studie have to be done by did-interested parties with double blind tests. You can’t have the wolf watching the hen house. This applies in every government agency

    • Gerie

      Absolutely!! (Also, even a short response to everyone sharing what we want shared will push the trollers to end of the conversation… NOT responding to those obviously trolling helps positive conversation… otherwise, trollers can take over the feed. My blood boils when I read some of the ignorant responses from those who refuse to acknowledge the need for questioning vaccine safety.. on many levels.. SO, even a short affirming can be helpful.. at least that’s what I’m told some FB folks.. perhaps I’m/they’re wrong.. we’ll see..

    • Bored Now

      You realize that the purpose of blinding is to remove the ability to consciously or unconsciously bias your data.

      • Larry Warshauer

        The double blind tests are important but equally important is having the tests done by disinterested parties. Parties with a vested interest in the outcome simply are too prone to manipulate the results or just outright falsify the findings.

        • Bored Now

          So the interested parties take the blinded data and change it how?

          • Ben

            Hey Jon. Why not tell us that story again—the one about when you nursed an abandoned baby squirrel back to health with your glorious lactating manbọọbs.

          • Bored Now

            Nothing says “I was schooled by Bored Now” more than following me like a puppy and nipping at my heels. Thanks.

          • Ben

            You mean’t to say: that I pointed out a serious, serious blunder on Paul Offit’s part and you—YOU!—refuse to admit it using gradeschool denials and half-feminine smiley emoticons.

            So, tell us about that baby squirrel again.

          • Bored Now

            Keep nipping at my heels Ben. 🙂

          • Ben

            Hey! At least I’m not nipping on a Twinkie®— using your plump lactating manboobs to dribble milk down in your coffee!

          • Bored Now

            Keep it up. Nothing says you got schooled more than your need to lash out. 🙂

          • Ben

            Whatever Jon. If you call your girly denials “schooling someone”, then that is just a cuntinuation on your theme.

            You still won’t admit it Jon. Lame Jon. Keep nursing your pet kitten with your manboobs, and make sure not to forget your prolactin injections and topical estradiol cream.

          • Bored Now

            Keep on lashing out Travis. 🙂

          • Ron Roy

            Actually Johnny aka Bored Now got his manboobs from eating chips and drinking Coke.

          • Ben

            This may be true, but he gets his super powers (of annoyance) from ginger snaps and graham crackers (he had actually learned his occult powers from Carrot Top.)

            Jon can pretty much get nearly anyone to bang their head against the desk with his occult girly mindgames. I would stay away from him. He works ginger-style voodoo for the vaccine clique.

  • cath

    I AM SO GLAD TO READ THESE COMMENTS!—THERE REALLY ARE MANY ENLIGHTENED PARENTS, YET WE ARE DEMEANED AS ‘CONSPIRACY THEORISTS’ WHEN IN FACT THESE FORCED VACCINATIONS ARE DAMAGING DOWN TO OUR DNA!—THE ACCEPTABLE???? LEVELS OF MERCURY, ALUMINUM, FORMALDEHYDE, MONKEY, DOG, CHICKEN, COW, PIG, DNA—WHAT!!!??? AND THE COURTS HAVE DEFENDED IT AS ‘UNSAFE ACCEPTABLE RISK’ OMG!!!

    IF MDs AND PARENTS ACTUALLY READ THE VACCINE INSERTS WITH THE LISTED AND MOST DISGUSTING AND DANGEROUS INGREDIENTS, THERE WOULD BE NO ACCEPTANCE OF VACCINES!

    IF VEGANS AND VEGETARIANS, AND SPIRITUAL PEOPLE REALIZED WHAT IS BEING SHOT INTO THEIR CHILDREN AND THEMSELVES [FLU VAX, ETC.], I THINK THERE WOULD BE A MAJOR VETO OF VACCINATIONS—IF THEIR DIET OR THEIR FAITH OR THEIR PHILOSOPHICAL BELIEF WOULD NOT ALLOW THEM TO EAT MEAT, WHAT ABOUT MONKEY OR DOG BEING INJECTED DIRECTLY INTO THEIR BLOODSTREAMS???

    THERE IS PROFIT IN KEEPING US SICK AND INFERTILE—THEY HAVE PILLS FOR THAT—AND THEN AN EARLY DEATH—KEEPING US OFF SOCIAL SECURITY, ALTHOUGH WE PAID INTO OUR ENTIRE, ALBEIT SHORT LIVES—CONSPIRACY TO KEEP POPULATION DOWN?

    YOU BET!

    • Gerie

      Absolutely, totally, cath. It’s all such a travesty.. vaccine industry is making trillions on us, and because it’s all sanctioned by the CDC, USPH, etc., majority of public accepts it all… Most MDs do NOT have the time to delve into the true research. And what was put out by CDC has been skewed to show no correlation btn autism and vaccines… and, of course, it’s not just autism.. we know that.

      • cath

        gerie—what you wrote is so accurate!—recently, i was listening to a webcast and one of the speakers mentioned that every person in congress receives $250k per year from BIG PHARMA—i don’t know if this is the absolute truth, but it makes total sense that our ‘representatives’ vote the way they do [GMOs, ETC.] and have sold us out—i have heard of ‘bonuses’ in the way of campaign contributions for re-election coming from the drug companies—our health is not their concern and with vaccines, they are all protected with the laws they passed—i just can’t comprehend that AMERICA accepts it as gospel when there has been over $3 billion paid out in vaccine court and probably twice over that denied damage claims—i know it is called PROPAGANDA and unfortunately it works for far too many parents—at the very least, these parents should question the science and research the statistics before they attack parents who don’t want vaccines for their children!—it is difficult dealing with closed minds, but we can’t remain silent

        • Gerie

          Yes, so glad to see your and others affirmations here! I just think we must keep speaking out; and I MUST return occasionally to my references, keep up-to-date, so I can respond intelligently to those who keep saying there’s no science behind questioning vaccine safety…. good grief, all they have to do is listen to some of the highly-qualified professionals who HAVE done their research… Yes, why on Earth NOT at least explore the questions a little… it’s about the health, the future of everyone… Don’t they realize the power of the vaccine industry and the entanglement of that industry with the vaccine unit of the CDC? Oye… oye…. and, realizing it’s just totally best to NOT feed those who obviously seem to be trolling… it does make their presence more powerful… What part of the country are you in, cath?? Thank you so much for continuing to speak out! My challenge: There’s just SO much to speak out on these days!!! If ONLY this was all I needed to be concerned about, life would be easier… and so sad that I can’t even speak to my children about this… they don’t want to hear.. sigh.. sigh….

          • Mike Stevens

            Your kids seem to be quite intelligent.
            Good on you for raising them.

          • Bored Now

            all they have to do is listen to some of the highly-qualified professionals who HAVE done their research

            I do listen to people who claim to have done their research and consider vaccines unsafe. I have yet to hear one who doesn’t offer anything but the weakest evidence for this position.

  • kyhamoge .

    “The love of money is the root of all evil…”

  • Gerie

    Thank you.. lots to study here… certainly no lack of research..

  • Truth59

    They can’t just be studied. There must be stipulations. They must be studied by an honest third-party who will allow the results to come out as they do, not as Pharma wants them to. Pharma is forbidden to give any gifts, contributions, campaign funds or whatever you want to call them to get the results they choose to come out as the result. There should be a HUGE fine or lifetime jail time — over a billion if they do.

    • Dip

      What’s your excuse for Gadad et al?

  • Larry Warshauer

    Obviously there are people on hear who have not seen “Vaxxed” or watched the 9 part series on the dangers of vaccinations (currently running). Please watch those films and then make decisions. Anyone who watches those films (with many many parents and experts and doctors and researchers giving their findings (how vaccinations have caused harm to people and how the government manipulates the data to help the help the pharma industry increase profits. – well watch those movies then let me know if you really think Andrew Wakefield falsified data. The only people who say that is the medical establishment who work for pharma.

  • Larry Warshauer

    You just ignore the data you don’t like (not show it to anyone or you just change the numbers. Not rocket science. Unethical yes. JUst flat out deception. If you watch the 9 part series on vaccinations and listen to Robert F Kennedy Jr. he talks how the pharma people when they realized that the vaccinations were linked to autism for the first 10 minutes were very upset and one even started crying (realizing that the product was hurting lots of babies – but within 1/2 hour all the group realized that they would soon be sued by hundreds of lawyers if this information became public so as a group they all decided to save their own skin they had to keep the truth from the public. The media is bought off by big pharma paying for all those ads and the politicians are bought off by big pharma funding campaigns. The idea to give a baby a vaccination doesn’t help them at all but instead just weakens and hurts their immune system.

    • Bored Now

      You just ignore the data you don’t like (not show it to anyone or you just change the numbers. Not rocket science.

      I thought you claimed that you wanted blinded studies? How do you ignore the data you don’t like or change it when you are blinded?

  • AutismDadd

    Nothing but supposition and CDC paid for science.

    • Moss Quito

      Yet I gave you 2 studies paid for by Anti vaxx groups. No correlation between autism and vaccine was found, much to the dismay of the antivaxxer group.
      The CDC paid for science..lmao..oh what, they have a secret slush fund I suppose. You are a joke.

  • AutismDadd

    Sorry Mike, I forgot to laugh.

  • Mike Stevens

    Wake up America! …etc…”

    You just have to be a Poe.
    Nobody could be this^ stupid, surely.
    Perhaps I am wrong, in which case I thank the Lord God for bringing together so much idiocy into one place, so people can have a good laugh at you all.

  • Mike Stevens

    “YOU CAN’T FIX STUPID”
    …as you have ably demonstrated with your contributions.

  • Bored Now

    More lashing out from Travis.

  • In what PMID number did Dr Baylock provide evidence for these things?

  • AutismDadd

    I take issue with the statement that vaccination takes place at the same ages neurological and developmental disorders first emerge. This is actually the issue in a nutshell. The coincidence theory has never been proven. Its a tactical explanation and nothing more.